Firstline Security and The Prodigy: The Unreal Lure of Reality
Posted by Karoli in Scams July 27th, 2007
Liz has a couple of excellent posts here and here with great links to some other blogs about Firstline Security and their puppet show, “The Prodigy”. I especially recommend her post on Reality TV and Summer Sales.
There’s an important distinction to be made between Reality TV and a concept like “The Prodigy”. I define the latter as a concept because there is really no indication that it has been sold, that they intend to sell it, or that the focus of the summer project has anything to do with the final product they call “The Prodigy”.
In the case of the Eldest, a camera was present twice: Once during a pep rally in June, and once around the third week of the 10-week stint. Both times it was centered around a staged event intended to bolster the masses. I found this snippet in one of the articles Liz quoted (in relation to the interview process in the initial recruiting phase, which took place at university locations throughout the country) to be very interesting:
“Everything is going to be filmed, and the show will be put together and edited by Actuality,” said Jerod Justice, a junior animal science major and district manager with Firstline. “At that point, it will be ’shopped’ out to major networks. There are already agreements being made, so it will definitely be televised, at least on a cable series.”
This is what they told the students involved in the ‘interview’ process — that it was being shopped to major networks. They also played up the relationship with GE, though they were not specific as to what that relationship was until the students went past the second interview process and were in attendance at the first ‘training session’.
Now, the idea presented with most reality shows is a give and take between the contestant and the producers. The contestants are presented with various challenges for which they apply their strategic, intellectual, physical, and sometimes evil talents to overcome. The idea as it’s presented on these shows is that the contestant still standing at the end wins it all, and that there is an IT to win.
Editorial comment here: In this particular case, the prize is purported to be nearly .75 Million dollars in VC money, a Hummer (humph), and some cash. They even trot out the previous “Prodigy”, who is actually the president of the Firstline division that recruits and hires the college students for summer sales. Do the math here. The person who wins (assuming there really is a winner to be had), will not be off on his own venture. He or She will be a fully-owned Firstline employee. Whatever VC dollars are actually paid out don’t have a thing to do with anyone’s own idea for a business unless that idea is something that jives with the Firstline business plan.
Most interesting to me was the actual paperwork they were given to sign. No mention at all of any reality show in the entire “Advertising Director Manual.” However, there were some eyebrow-raising moments in my read through the whole thing. Here are some highlights:
- A minimum production of 10 accounts per month is expected.
- Licensing is the responsibility of the individual, not the company
- A trade secrets and non-compete agreement is required. The non-compete extends for 24 months.
- Exclusive employment during the term of the contract (as if they’d have any time for anything else…sheesh)
- The real icing on the cake is the Promissory Note they are required to sign at the outset, promising to repay any shortage for advanced ‘housing allowance’ and ’signing bonus’ if they don’t complete the term. 18% interest on the unpaid balance. Yeah, buddy. (Smacking the boy upside the head for signing this one…SIGH).
Does this sound like a contract for a reality show or an apprenticeship/indentured servant agreement to you?
Moving on to sales tactics, I found this gem. This is when there is an already-installed system on the premises. They suggest opening the conversation with this: “I see you’re with XYZ company and I’m here to switch you over to Firstline.” Say WHAT? “I’m upgrading customers with that equipment to the newer equipment”.
Familiar with the term “slamming”? Slamming is what the long distance phone companies do when they call to get you to switch to their service. It’s a smooth and incredibly dishonest technique, where the rep calls and starts the conversation by saying they’ve reviewed your current plan and have a better plan for you. By the time you’re hooked up to the recorded part of the call and giving your info, it’s disclosed that you’re really switching your long distance service to another company. This is the same technique.
So look, the bottom line here is that The Prodigy is a scam, just like Liz calls it. It was a vehicle to sell crap wrapped in the phony allure of fame and fortune. It’s easy to believe these shows are reality, but DG’s experience with AGT (remember, she auditioned in “Chicago”…yeah right) proves otherwise. In this case, it isn’t even a real show…it’s the promise of a real show.
To the commenters who have left remarks about how successful they’ve been with Firstline, I have only this to add to what I’ve written above: You were selling systems when the market wasn’t saturated. You now have a saturated market and some negative customer feedback. At least here in California, your “advertising directors” are being dropped into underprivileged neighborhoods or neighborhoods where systems are already installed by ADT, Honeywell and other vendors. So while you enjoyed success with it, it’s not nearly the lucrative proposition that it was before, which is why deceptive recruiting techniques are now being used to get fresh blood for the enterprise.
So in our case, the Eldest will end his summer about $2K in debt to Alltel, no cash in the bank, and having to take a semester off to recover what he lost through this endeavor. I don’t count that as success and neither does he. In fairness to Firstline, he should have shed the ‘pie inthe sky’ aspirations and looked at the whole thing a bit more cynically, but hey - they do have some excellent salesmen shilling their product
My takeaway from this: The wireless industry needs to be opened up and opened up soon. Part of why they can get away with this stuff is because there isn’t any real competition out there or innovative products. Whether it’s Verizon or AT&T or GE or Firstline, it’s all the same crap wrapped in different paper. Firstline’s services were wireless, with add-ons for VOIP and other wireless promises for the future, all overpriced and not very much value for the money. If the service is worth buying, it shouldn’t need ‘advertising directors’ hawking it door-to-door in the first place.
Technorati Tags: firstline, security, the prodigy, scam, direct sales, marketing, college, summer jobs
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…living life in 19/7 time 
yo, you are exactly right. I have been an “advertising director” before. it’s a joke. sounds like you have a legal background? I’m finishing law school right now (no thanks to firstline) whaddya say we get together and teach these guys a lesson?
Hi Tom the Bomb,
I’m just on the fringe of the legal eagles as a third-party benefit administrator…certainly not qualified to take ‘em on. My goal is really to present the other side of the Firstline recruiting scam, which truly sucks people in before slamming them with the reality of what they’ll be doing.
While I have nothing to say about The Prodigy, I can say that the first year I worked in Firstline I made over $50,000. This, being my second summer, I have already sold more than 150, making $100,000 in the process. Sales is not an easy job, and those who are weak minded, weakly disciplined, and unwilling to make sacrifices will never amount to anything in any type of sales. Firstline has changed my life in more ways than I can count. I have paid off every loan to my name, helped pull my parents out of bankruptcy, drive a $65,000 car, and have established financial freedom. I will step up to bat any time for Firstline and anyone who strives to give people the opportunities I have been fortunate enough to have fall into my lap. Area? Saturated markets? Selling air? Give me a break…Thanks to Firstline I could sell salt to a slug. I have watched many people fail at this, and it’s not entirely their fault. Weakness is bred into people by those around them (i.e. parents who make excuses for a failed attempt to fly, blaming the cliff they attemted to fly from, or cursing the winds for not carrying them). I have only accomplished the things I have because of those above and around me. “If I have seen further, it is because I stood on the shoulders of giants.”-Sir Isaac Newton. Firstline is a blessing. One way or another people will find things out about themselves they never knew before doing this. Success or failure, riches or empty pockets, if you’re out here for the money, you’re out here for the wrong reason.
#1 Rep,
I’m really glad that you’ve been able to be successful. More power to ya. Having said that, I take issue with some of your judgments on others; specifically:
Area? Saturated markets? Selling air? Give me a break…Thanks to Firstline I could sell salt to a slug.
Yes, I have not argued with this single benefit of time with Firstline. Anyone who spends time doing this will definitely be able to sell, even salt to a slug. Does that make it less deceptive or better? Nah…It just means that you’ve got the skill of pressuring someone to sign on the dotted line on impulse whether they need to or not.
I have watched many people fail at this, and it’s not entirely their fault. Weakness is bred into people by those around them (i.e. parents who make excuses for a failed attempt to fly, blaming the cliff they attemted to fly from, or cursing the winds for not carrying them).
Wow, you’ve gone beyond drinking the KoolAid right into mixing it for other folks to drink with this statement. You are obviously suited for direct sales and that’s great. Not every person is. Maybe because they look intimidating, or they’re not articulate or they just feel weird knocking on someone’s door. I don’t know what it is, but trying to jam every person on the planet without the gift for face-to-face sales is just silly. Not only that, but you’ve decided to blame everyone but the folks at Firstline, who clearly share some of it when folks fail. Sorry, but there are some who make awesome mechanical engineers or insurance actuaries who shouldn’t ever attempt direct sales. That doesn’t make them failures. Get real here and acknowledge that what works for you won’t work for everyone, nor should it. (I won’t speak to the question of how ethics factor into this — you’re the one who has to look in the mirror and like the person looking back at you).
Success or failure, riches or empty pockets, if you’re out here for the money, you’re out here for the wrong reason.
Precisely, but THAT’S HOW IT WAS SOLD. Dude, hear this. These students had the promise of the big bucks put in front of them. Did they wake up one morning and say “Gosh, I feel compelled to be a Firstline evangelist and walk the streets selling security systems all day!”? No, of course not.
They were RECRUITED ON THE PROMISE OF THE MONEY. So don’t point a finger of judgment at them for actually wanting to make some.
Ok so here’s what it comes down to pussies this job isn’t for everyone obviously it’s not for you because you could handle the heat,sweat,and chugging rockstars every morning before corrolation’s but for you girls that are bitching about it on the internet antyhting that makes you feel better about failing!!! I geuss you mst have been one of the slackers that got sent home because sitting under a tree for seven hours was much more enjoyable than securing someones home and family. that’s what i take pride in this job. and yes im sure the prodigy will be out one day and you will feel real stupid for writing this article and i was in panama city on spring break when i heard about the prodigy and signed up for it two weeks later i got a call from who is now the coolest manager ever and im doing alright iv’e got 52 installs it aint bad considering we started with 28 sales reps now were down to 6 and 3 managers and im making a carreer out of this job so i wil have these kind of skills to last me the rest of my life I love my Job!!!
Jeremy,
Your inarticulate and somewhat predictable use of the word “pussies” more or less undoes whatever point you were trying to make.
However, I slogged through and am very happy that it works for you. It sounds like you don’t need any stinkin’ million dollar payoff anyway, so why do you care if the Prodigy happens?
I agree to the fact that the money is a luring key into the Firstline program as an Advertising Director. It got me. Whats not appealing about make an unlimited potential of money, and paying off my schools debts at 20? It gets the best of us.
I agree with Jeremy in a way that he’d do anything for his Firstline family. The people Ive met are amazing, and my time with them has changed my life in a big way. You find a much larger respect for people who do this from all different lifestyles. Its amazing how people come together when its seriously one of the hardest times of your life.
But disagree with his comment about weakness. I find it hard to believe that you can put that generalization into every single person who has set foot in the program. I myself went into the program, this summer, and came home after 3 weeks. I admit partly to a weakness. However, my father left for Iraq for a year (without prior knowledge until I got there) , 2 family members were on there deathbed, pending approval to stay at my university because of academic reasons–all in the time I was there, this was thrown on my shoulders.
I missed out I admit. But what I wanted to do, and what I needed to….at that point was 2 different things.
I don’t believe that the market is saturated by any means, it all depends on your presentation and if the customer has a true need for the product at that time. You see it in everyday life….
ClassyAggie09,
Your handle is an apt description. You are one of the few Firstliners who has made a reasonable and balanced comment. And I do agree with you about the bonding that happens between the team. I think there are probably lifelong friends that have been made as a result of the experience.
The market saturation is probably a function of location. I was really speaking to the saturation here in California, where it really has been saturated for years. Perhaps it isn’t the same in Texas.
I hope your situation has improved, and that your father remains safe and well during his time in Iraq.
Its time to get loud,
Its time to represent,
Jack-son-ville what time is it!!
We are the smallest office by far and we started late. We don’t get paid what we expected but God damnit, I love sellin with everyone I have met in this company. I will do this the rest of my life, and so will everyone else I work with. Plus, I get free home cooked dinner almost every day from families that I may end up saving their lives some day.
Firstline, ans summer sales in general is a great job, there is alot of negative spin on the indusrty buut I love it and will continue to grow Firstline to become one of the industry leader.
[...] it was insane. My brief foray into the underbelly of reality shows this summer, both real and unreal, hasn’t changed that opinion. As a parent, I cannot imagine sending my child off with a [...]
It’s funny how you people say this job isn’t for everyone, not for the weak minded. Thats funny because it’s kind of hard to be good at sales when the product you are selling is a complete scam, go ahead and read the back of the paperwork and find out about this so called security systems. I believe I heard from over half the doors I knocked on say that Firstline has the most false alarm. hmm that could get expenses. Congrats on your life changing experience because you probably ruined some family’s life by giving them this bullshit. Well you guys are good at what you do, which is decieving people. One word for this company SHADY.. Thats all folks…. see you at correlation.
It’s funny how you people say this job isn’t for everyone, not for the weak minded. Thats funny because it’s kind of hard to be good at sales when the product you are selling is a complete scam, go ahead and read the back of the paperwork and find out about this so called security systems. I believe I heard from over half the doors I knocked on say that Firstline has the most false alarm. hmm that could get expenses. Congrats on your life changing experience because you probably ruined some family’s life by giving them this bullshit. Well you guys are good at what you do, which is decieving people. One word for this company SHADY.. Thats all folks…. see you at correlation.
I admit, I fell for the carrot, that was dangled in front of me when I was recruited. I felt betrayed, lied to, empty when I found out the truth, that I wasn’t going to make the money that I was hoping to make. I came out to work for Firstline to obtain enough money to put a down payment on a house. I figured out later that it wasn’t as easy as the recruiter said I’d obtain. The payscale was not explained. I guess bad on my part because I trusted the recruiter. It was explained to me that we would recieve but a small portion of what our backend would be, a sum of money that would berly sustain one self through the summer. To my surprise that was not the case. I was finally told the truth by another source, which quickly crushed me. I honestly had worked so hard during the summer, somedays having dinner at ten ‘o clock as the only meal, I was the top first rep in my office. It felt like I had worked for NOTHING. I was told that I would probably be the only one with a backend which would probably be real small. I felt like I was in a HUGE hole. I think that management knew we would be all depressed from the realization that is the backend, then an opportunity to dig out of the hole….. The EXTENSION! I was offered double the money up front for the month of august. It was like i was stuck with knocking doors for the rest of the summer. As soon as i was going to just call it quits, my mother called me, (not knowing what was happening) she gave a word of advice, “no matter what happens, your family will always be there for you. I know that the money that was promised is not what you expected, i knew that when you presented the job with enthusiasm. I hope that you take as much from this experience that is needed to be obtained.” i realized that i wouldnt get anything out of this experience always looking at the negative points of the summer. I have to get something out of the summer, i have to be an optomist at this point, being an pessimist was not going to make the situation light. So im not going to make the money that i thought i would, now i needed to move on and make the best out of the situation. So now im working hard proving to my self that although its not what i thought the summer would be, but at least i gave MY all during the summer. Its kinda like donating to a charity, you do it because its the right thing to do, but if they charity actually uses the donation for the intended purpose or not, is not of my worries. I did my part. I feel the same way about this summer. I worked hard, i learned a lot, i did my part with integrity. I realized how selfish and hard the world can be, i think that many people have their first experience with the harsh reality of business and sales this summer, which ANY sales company obtains the same “shady” tactics. Its not so much taking all the negativity away from the summer its making the best of what there is, thats true progress. I wonder how many people that quit because of shady tactics, would have stayed and not minded the tactics if the pay was really was as it was presented, and if the summer job was easy how many people would still be knocking doors? Alot of reps that left were because it was a hard job. I know first hand. We are all greedy at some point.
Anonymous above,
You have a wise mother who has passed her wisdom on to you. When it’s all said and done, you have taken the best lessons possible away from the experience. I didn’t use the exact words she did, but something close — basically to take the skills learned and apply them in an environment that was honest, up-front, and which would reward hard work.
I’m not sure the ones who quit because of the tactics would have stayed if they’d been paid what they were promised, because if they didn’t use those tactics, they weren’t succeeding.
when you say tactics do you mean lying and decieving honest, hard working people… those tactics are very good traits to have life let me tell you…
to anonymous above:
I have worked in sales for nine years, when I worked for a communications company called MCI the tactics were very shady to obtain new customers, we actually were trained to lie. I worked in a bar at applebees, our liquor percentage had to very high, basically the bar was losing money, on the computer there was this button for long pouring it added an extra 40 cents to the price, we were told that on top of the happy hour price we had to long pour twice. The customer had no idea, basically we were robbing the customer, loored in be a tactic of ” happy hour” but charged in the end full price. I obtained a phone from at&t their tactic was a free phone!! But with a minimum of a hundred dollar a month plan with a contract, and 200 dollar activation. Those are sales tactics! Are they honest? NO. CREDIT CARDS? Now thats a scam! Its servival of the fitist. Not everyone is honest. “advertising” is just firstlines sales tactics. Lol and its honestly just home security, its not an insurance company or a financial institution.
Anonymous above this one:
MCI’s tactics are the reason there are laws about long-distance slamming, which is exactly what Firstline sales reps are trained to do with security systems.
On the AT&T thing, I’ve been with Cingular (now AT&T) for 5 years and have never, ever had to get a plan with the fees you describe. The plan I’ve had is $39.99/month, plus phone, and I just added a data plan for $20/month. No $200 activation. If you paid that, you should’ve spent some time on the Internet first.
Credit cards are the biggest scam going. No question. But I have yet to see a credit card salesperson at my front door. I did, however, get a solicitation yesterday for a card with 29.99% interest. That should be outlawed….there’s no way anyone should be paying that kind of rate on a card. Which is why, by the way, I have no credit cards. Not one, and I like it like that.
As to your statement about “it’s just home security”, you should talk to your fellow sales partners about (start the patriotic music here) lives are saved, property preserved, God love the USA and all that.(stop music)
I work for FIRSTLIE and they are that cheating lying dishonest scammers. Caution every thing there is a lie or tied to lies.
you know it was my first summer with firstline and i tell you what, i had alot of fun, didnt make million dollars like they said i would but i came out on top with a little something.
you guys that are complaining,theres no way you can tell me that you didnt learn valuable skills.
and if you didnt you must have been in lalaland all summer. all you people sleepin under trees in the park its crazy ive seen it. your out here already, get to work, make some ca$h money.
but one thing i didnt like about firstline is that they keep first years in the dark,kinda like paying your dues.
i learned quick thats how it worked so with that knowledge anything some managers would say you can just see through the bs sales tactics “redirect” its pretty ridicoulous sometimes. its like dude i know what your trying to do or bro im talking about this dont ask me about somethig else answer the bloody question. ha ha
but after the “initation to the cult” as some people think.lol its pretty tight as long as u work hard and play harder
also seperate work from your freakin life,i hate when coworkers thats all they talk about. i think thats why most people dont like, burnout you know.
Its definitly not for everyone it, but if you come back they reward you for that.
Think about it this way, now that you know whats going on all the more to make more flow$$$$$$
i heard firstline is in alot of finacial trouble
Sorry folks, but I do delete posts that are nothing more than gratuitous slams on people participating in the conversation. If your comment is missing, that’s why.
ok….. first off… you guys need to sit back and re evaluate what your saying here, your sitting here slamming the good reps left and right, calling us liars and cheaters and scammers…. but guess what…. we are people just like you, in this world there are 2 types of people buyers and then there is sellers, you don’t get mad at the guy who sold you your cell phone do you? didn’t think so, the only people who generally get pissed off, are the people didn’t listen to you when you where talking to them, now i was the number one first year rep for firstline in 2007, i sold installed 211 accounts, and i would be willing to let you call anyone of the people that i sold and ask them if there satisfied with the system and if i lied to them in anyway….. in fact i call each one of my customers 1 month after i sell them to make sure everything is going well for them, you know why? because i care…. one of the things about the country anymore that pisses me off is the fact that customer care sucks, and i don’t want to be one of “those guys” that you point out, and yeah there are a few bad apples, hell thats like generalizing an entire race of people of 100,000 of of 1000 of them, its just wrong, and yeah this job excuse my language …. is fuck’n hard, i’ve put blood sweat and tears into this job, blisters, sore feet, and lost a girl i cared about a lot, because i was half way across the country, so this job does take a special type of person, someone who doesn’t just give on the drop of a dime, someone who doesn’t just say i quit, the type of person when your holding them down on the ground about to break there arm they don’t say uncle, you know why? because we are the back bone of this country, we are the people you guys turn to when you need something done, we are the ones who make the tough choices in life, we are the real men, and I’m sorry but don’t give me this bullshit about how firstline screwed you, man up, admit you made a mistake, you didn’t read though your rep agreement… deal with it… quit making mistakes for yourself you’ll never be truly successful until you realize that 99% of the bad stuff in you life could have be prevented… by you. so a little bit of advice, when looking for someone to blame, why don’t you look in the mirror?
o and by the way the prodigy is very real, i was on it…. i cant say much more though…
Firstline is Bankrupt!!! HAHA I guess justice is served bitches
Firstline is Bankrupt!!! HAHA I guess justice is served bitches.. By the way Nemer you would be much happier with any other company..
Firstline was bought out by pinnacle. Ive already recieved my backend but do you think they’ll give people their year end check.
Okay, so now we have the rumor that they filed for bankruptcy today and the second rumor that they were acquired by Pinnacle.
Here’s what I’m guessing, and it’s just speculation based on past history. They did exactly what they did a couple of years ago — they sold their contracts to Pinnacle to get out from under the requirement to service them so they would have liquid assets to start the recruiting cycle for this year’s fresh-faced group of newly-sold summer recruits.
They did it in 2002 or 2003. It’s a lovely deal for them — none of the obligations, all of the liquidity.
But someone, please…if you’re going to post rumors, at least link back to something or copy an excerpt of an email or whatever, because right now it’s all rumor and/or speculation.
It’s pretty sad when you look up on google to see what people say about the company that you work for. I have heard a ton of rumors, but I don’t dare put those down since I don’t want to hurt those that I care about.
All I know is that I am not holding my breath and I am telling my team to look for another job. It’s just sad though cause I will really miss my team. I have been working here for almost two years.
I also feel horrible for our customers. What will they do? What about the investors and other companies that were doing business with Firstline?
All I know is that most people who know the inside story are leaving fast. Tons of people will suffer because they don’t even know what’s happening. Yet the owners get away with it. I almost feel sorry for them (the owners)… almost.
hey grunt boy dont feel bad for the owners bro there livin this up.these guys are already millionaires. who cares about them. Although i do feel bad about current employees. and karoli its not a rumor its true i dont have any thing to show you but its very true that they have merged with pinnacle.
Strange how before I signed up for the “Director of Advertising” for Firstline Security/GE, I could find nothing negative on Google about the company… and now that I’ve gone through the process and am passed the denial of the shadiness of this company, I find all kinds of negative things online! PS, I was part of an office this summer that moved three times, three different cities, three different states… We “left” one state because we were told our licenses were “not in proper order.”
There should be an advertising director Union. Too much that the hardworking/honest college students get screwed out of by upper management/owners.
Oh I know that the owners are not hurting for money, but as far as their character is concerned… that’s another story. That’s why I feel bad for them; they have cut so many corners and lied so much that they have become something that they might not even know they are.
Now I was under the impression that FL didn’t join with Pinnacle, in fact they now going to have to just downsize a bunch because Pinnacle didn’t take FL’s customers. Oh well…
so I am a returning rep (last year was my first) and have a good deal of info. I worked out in So Cal this summer and it was fucking hot all summer long. Overall, I feel I was underpaid, but had the promise of a big backend (ended up being negative). I got a free cruise, some fres stuff from contests and all, but still feel underpaid.
As for Firstline merging/bankrupt, I have heard all that stuff too. I can’t point to concrete evidence but I have talked to a lot of managers. One manager (Huffman I think) was given his backend check a few weeks ago of $25,000 and it promptly bounced. Firstline won’t give him his money. Basically, about half the managers and reps have fled Firstline to other companies. Firstline is fucked. 2 of there divisions are almost entirely empty. I’m in the crowd that’s swinging to other security companies for next year. I just gotta say, APX is a million times more organized and efficient than Firstline. Their pay is $400+/account even for first year reps.
I can answer many more questions if you ask em…
swingshift
I currently just quit my fristline job in the Service deparment because of the black male and underground shit that was been active this last few week.They have kept us employees in the dark about FRISTLINE GOING BANKRUPT. After several months of the of working at fristline , i quit, Relizing that i did not enjoy lying to customers to save a company i did not agree with. The hardest part was to disagree with someon when they were completely right. Fristline is full of Unprofessional, dirty nosed liers.
So, shouldn’t we be getting our tax info from Firstline soon??
So can anyone answer the question, is Firstline Security going bankrupt or merging?
To Upgrade Scheduled Out: They don’t have to mail them until 1/31, so watch for it to arrive in early February.
I still can’t find anything confirming that there’s a merger or a bankruptcy. If they follow what they’ve done in past years, they’ll be selling the contracts to someone like ADT or Pinnacle and starting again with the current recruiting season. No bankruptcy, just a nice clean slate with no past obligations. Of course, in the current economy they might have trouble finding buyers for those contracts.
Karoli,
Firstline is in a very bad dilemma. From my understanding, Firstline is a contract dealer. Like you said, they usually sell to established companies. However, both Pinnacle and Firstline used a monitoring company called SAI this year. This is their biggest problem. SAI has hired to monitor and manage and bill the accounts. SAI basically fucked everything up. They charged customers multiple times per month (I had one of my customers get charged 5x in August), dropped monitoring on accounts, had software failures resulting in houses not being connected to “the grid,” and many other things.
Because of this instability, many of Firstline’s investors withdrew their investments. ADT usually invests (by purchasing these contracts) millions of dollars in Firstline. However, this year, ADT recognized all the problems and withdrew their bid on buying the contracts. So Firstline is stuck with all these contracts and is unable to sell them off and make a ROI. This is why they are going bankrupt and having to merge with Pinnacle.
Another reason is because what I said above. I, along with 30-50 other salesmen have jumped ship to another company (NOT Pinnacle). 2 whole divisions (Papa’s and Taggart’s I think) are now skeletons. They have no returning workforce. They are essentially having to start at the ground again, thus the NEED to merge with Pinnacle just to make sales this next season.
ask me more
-swingshift
Firstline is Bankrupt at this point, the only 2 offices that will be opened are california, and utah , Which now is merging with Pinnicale. Both shady companys, Firstline is now refusing checks to Empolyees as the 2 owners take off with 14 million a peice after fileing bankrupt over 3 weeks ago, not telling anyone that there will be no checks 3 weeks from now, Everyone is in the dark. No one knows the real truth
swingshift,
The scenario you describe makes a ton of sense. It’s the first one that gives some legs to the rumors posted here and I’ll keep watching for some news about it. You’d think that if checks are bouncing and payments aren’t made to folks who worked all summer long for nothing there will be some press play somewhere about it.
BTW, there are two facebook groups around this if you’re not already aware — here and here.
Firstline security sent all of the customer care representatives home today with no paycheck for the past two weeks. The only information disclosed was that Firstline is in court at this very moment disputing a claim that will give them money to pay the employees. We were told that “hopefully” by monday we’ll have our paychecks. They said they are 75% sure of it. Firstline bankrupt? I think so. All of the service departments were downsized to two people each department earlier this week. Firstline always lies to customers and I guess same treatment was to be expected for employees as well. Everyone is out looking for new jobs, even the managers are packed up and sending resumes to new employers.
The sad thing about this company this past week is that I am finding that many of the rumors that were going around are in fact true. Why can’t management grow some balls and tell the employees the straight up truth? Why can’t the owners face their own employees and tell us what the hell is going on. I am tired of hearing crap passed down through management. Its sad that the owners can’t even stand up for their own company and make their workers do all the dirty work while they profit from it. Thanks to lies and cowards I am now looking for another job. Thanks fuckedupline!
The service department managers have officially called us to let us know we are jobless and Firstline Security has filed for bankruptcy. It was fun while it lasted I loved everyone there. Good bye to Firstline and everyone who worked there.
Firstline is a huge scam. I live in an area where a bunch of “Firstline guys” live and they are all shady! Between them and Living Scriptures it just continues to give Mormons a bad name!
“HIGHLY IMPORTANCE NOTICE: Firstline Employees: As many of you may have heard, several of Firstline’s largest creditors have taken informal and formal legal actions that have resulted in Firstline’s inability to sell customer accounts and generate operating revenue to pay its ongoing expenses. As recent as this Wednesday, Jan 23rd, Firstline was required by court-order to hold all funds generated by the sale of customer accounts pending a final hearing for appointment of a receiver for the company. Firstline has diligently endeavored to resolve the issues raised by its creditors so that accounts could be sold and expenses paid, but has been unable to do so. After considering the wide array of circumstances—including what is in the best interests of employees—Firstline has determined that it is necessary to seek federal bankruptcy protection under chapter 11. Firstline is confident that reorganization under chapter 11 will provide the best result for payment of employees and will further provide the ability to move forward as a company and continue to operate. The short-term ramifications of filing chapter 11 are unpleasant. Until Firstline obtains permission from the bankruptcy court, it cannot pay any debts that were owed as of the date of filing. This means that Firstline will be unable to meet its payroll obligations to you today. The good news is, however, that the money owed to you as current wages (with certain limitations including a $10,000 cap) will be treated as a priority claim in the bankruptcy to be paid ahead of general unsecured creditors. Additionally, all wages earned after the bankruptcy filing are treated as administrative expenses in the case and are also required to be paid ahead of all general unsecured creditors. This means those of you we seek help in rebuilding will have secured pay moving forward. Firstline’s immediate order of business in the bankruptcy will be to seek permission to pay priority wage claims early so that the burden on you will be lessened. This process may, however, can take several weeks to accomplish. To facilitate reorganization, it is unfortunately necessary for Firstline to temporarily reduce its excellent staff to a group of core rebuilders who will begin the task of stablizing and rebuilding the business. The personnel on the attached list are those that we feel are necessary to accomplish this objective. To those not on the list, please understand that you are valued and appreciated and that we deeply regret circumstances that have led us to the point that we must reduce our staff. We credit the successes of the company to everyone, and we hope that you understand that we will do everything that we can to rebuild, rehire, and, most importantly, to pay you in full for the excellent services you have provided. Please encourage the rebuilding team as they are all of our hopes for a brighter future and immediate potential for future jobs, future pay etc. Please await further information via email and mail. We implore your support and patience. There is a quote from Mother Teresa that says: ―What you spend years building may be destroyed overnight – BUILD ANYWAY! People are unreasonable, illogical, and self centered – LOVE THEM ANYWAY!‖ Firstline Security, Inc”
From the man himself. Feel free to distribute as you’d like, there is no information above that is not a matter of public record.
It is funny that Jake Dahl says there “is a lot of negative spin on the indusrty” because of him, and all the shady people under him, Firstline is in the mess that they are in. Jake Dahl brags about selling 200 accounts a year but in reality he is extremely dishonest in the way he does it. If your home is Protected with ADT, Jake works for ADT, if you are with ACME, Jake works for ACME etc. Because of Jake’s “leadership” ADT filed a lawsuit against Firstline. Now of Jake’s 200 accounts that he did about 40 are good. Nice job Jake!!! I remember a training I went to last year and all Jake talked about was respect. He kept saying “respect me I deserve your respect”, really? ok? 40 Good accounts Jake that is what first year reps do. You are no better than first year reps and you have been doing this for 5 years. Thanks to dishonest people like Jake Dahl companies have to suffer. It talks about honesty if Firstlines mission statement but Jake cares more about $$$ than what is best for the company that pays him. Oh well. Wathch out APX Jake Dahl is on your side.
It is funny that Jake Dahl says there “is a lot of negative spin on the indusrty” because of him, and all the shady people under him, Firstline is in the mess that they are in. Jake Dahl brags about selling 200 accounts a year but in reality he is extremely dishonest in the way he does it. If your home is Protected with ADT, Jake works for ADT, if you are with ACME, Jake works for ACME etc. Because of Jake’s “leadership” ADT filed a lawsuit against Firstline. Now of Jake’s 200 accounts that he did about 40 are good. Nice job Jake!!! I remember a training I went to last year and all Jake talked about was respect. He kept saying “respect me I deserve your respect”, really? ok? 40 Good accounts Jake that is what first year reps do. You are no better than first year reps and you have been doing this for 5 years. Thanks to dishonest people like Jake Dahl companies have to suffer. It talks about honesty if Firstlines mission statement but Jake cares more about $$$ than what is best for the company that pays him. Oh well. Watch out APX Jake Dahl is on your side.
When and how will we get paid and why do owners end up with 14 million each?
I am sad and feel bad for what was written about me today on this website. I am not perfect by anymeans and make alot of mistakes. But let me say this, out of the 202 accounts that where installed I have 9 open tickets and have personally paid over 2000.00 for customers that felt mislead. I currently have 192 good accounts the last time I looked.
I was a very loyal employee and worked very hard to build Firstline. Infact I never once looked at other companies until all my reps where leaving me because of the rumors issues of the company. Thy day Apx came to my home with the sole purpose to bring me on I told them no way, I am to loyal and love the people I worked with. Later that day I had one of my best friends Tomio Huffman call me and tell me he had quit. It scared me that all the top guys in the company where not satisfied with things and alot where quiting the industry. This is what convinced me to leave to APX.
whoever SOMEONE is that wrote the comment above. I am sorry you feel that way and hope you can forgive me for whatever I have done, but let me say this. I have my integrity and do my best to be moral in all I do. I switched out 40% of my accounts this year. FYI.
Firstline was a great company with great leaders. Its very sad what happened. I would love to see anyone run a company that size. I also do not believe The owners meant or planned anything like this to ever happen. And personally I forgive them for any problems they made.
I hurts that someone thinks I am shady and am the reason why Firstline went down and had so many issues. I love selling alarms, I love training people and hope to do it the rest of my career.
To whoever reads this message- a negative attitude will never bring you success it only tears down. And if I have wronged you I am sorry!
Jake Dahl is right, SOMEONE is wrong! Jake can sell more people than anyone I have ever met! There ain’t nothin’ thats gonna hold him down. I hope APX gave him a big sign on bonus cuz Jake is worth every penny. Watch for Jake to be an APX TOP SELLER IN 2008!
Jake was my manager in 2005, he is a great guy and taught me to sell with integrity, I think he is an amazing leader and whoever wrote that about him needs to call me! 801-243-7352.
I respect him
To all:
I generally remove comments that are personal attacks on others. I am going to leave “someone’s” comment simply because it has had a response that would appear out of context without the original comment posted.
However, it’s worth remembering that while the Firstline outcome is horrible, it was inevitable and shouldn’t be pinned on people who worked there and believed in what they were doing. I’m sure Jake sold those accounts because he was a good salesman who believed what he’d been told, and also believed he was helping others in their success.
To me, this is the real ugly in luring students to sell systems unter the subterfuge of a reality show. It changes the filters everyone views their actions through, masking the pyramid under a pie in the sky.
Firstline’s business model was headed for failure because it presumed that many solid contracts would be sold, and that they would then resell those contracts to a third party, re-infusing the company with cash to begin recruiting anew. The pyramid collapsed when the contracts couldn’t be sold, and the ones who are paying are the customers and the students, particularly those who were recruited at this time last year, asked to recruit their friends, sent into territories that were already saturated, and ultimately ended the summer owing Firstline money instead of making any.
At any rate, feel free to comment, but do keep it free of personal attacks on others. I will delete those.
I THINK THAT SOMEONE is most likely a guy named MIKE Proudfit. I can see him saying that kind of stuff about jake, even after jake made him a butt load of money the last 5 years.